Virgin Galactic’s WhiteKnightTwo Returns to Mojave
After spending months at Spaceport America in New Mexico, Virgin Galactic’s WhiteKnightTwo carrier ship VMS Eve flew back to the Mojave Air and Space Port in California on Friday.
The pilots made about a half dozen low passes over runway 12-30. Several were just above the runway, while others were touch-and-goes on which they briefly landed before soaring again into the desert sky.
Virgin Galactic officials have said that WhiteKnightTwo would return to Mojave to transport SpaceShipTwo VSS Unity to the Spaceport America to complete its flight test program.
Virgin Galactic is hoping to fly it founder, Richard Branson, on the first commercial SpaceShipTwo suborbital flight in time for his 70th birthday on July 18.
The company has said it has a backlog of 603 ticket holders who have paid either $200,000 or $250,000 apiece. Thousands of other potential space tourists have expressed interest in signing up once Virgin Galactic starts selling tickets again, officials said. The company plans to take reservations at an even higher price once commercial service begins.
53 responses to “Virgin Galactic’s WhiteKnightTwo Returns to Mojave”
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It is really interesting to see just how irrelevant VG has become to the future of space development. Like Zero Gravity Corp., VG is still around, but just doesn’t seem to matter anymore. I guess that is what happens after nearly twenty years of hype.
that is your own judgment and comes from a guy who buys every babble out of Elon “any day to the Moon now” mouth
If VG is able to manage the technology safely and if there is the backlog they claim…then VG could become the primary and first money maker for humans in space. (yes I discount Mir corp and other things which just acted as a staging point for Russian space policy)
if they make money driving humans into and out of space and start to sell the experience it will be something that no one else has done yet…ie developed a product of spaceflight that humans buy
there are a lot of ifs here but far less then the daily flow of ifs that come out of Elon’s mouth.
It’s the judgement of someone who is trained in economics and has long studied how industries emerge. The problem is that as a pilot you see anything that has wings on it as good and so fell for Sir Richard Branson’s hype.
As for the “hype” of Elon Musk, keep in mind unlike Sir Richard his hype is backed up by a decade of actually building and launching spacecraft into orbit, not an occasional “suborbital” flight to high altitude.
It’s the judgement of someone who is trained in economics and has long :studied how industries emerge.
VG and the effort to nibble at space access is a case study of how industries emerge. in your Elon world, we go from nothing to B747’s all in one leap
the wing comment is a cheap and useless shot. I was not a fan of the shuttle and it clearly had wings
“As for the “hype” of Elon Musk, keep in mind unlike Sir Richard his hype
is backed up by a decade of actually building and launching spacecraft
into orbit, not an occasional “suborbital” flight to high altitude”
Musk in his one decade of building and operating launch vehicles that have launched spacecraft into orbit has done nothing that has not been done for 1/2 century before.
He has recovered parts of the vehicle…but event hat has been done before
and for that you are ready to assume he can leap from nothing special to the B747 of flight. its not clear that is doable
I dont know that VG will succeed either…but if they do…they are the ones who create the industry start up not Musk
Like so many of the public you view space from the narrow perspective of human space flight. The Starship’s initial bread and butter market will be launching satellites into orbit not humans. Eventually it will carry humans, but only after numerous flights without any to work out the bugs.
By contrast SpaceshipTwo only real market is taking humans to high altitudes. They may claim its space if they get high enough, but it’s really nothing but a high altitude version of what Zero G Corporation has been doing, basically replicating the 60 year old X-15 flights. It’s not taking folks to the future, it’s just replicating the past like an excursion on a steam train.
Like so many of the public you view space from the narrow perspective of human space flight….
thats a claim on your part that is not validated by any comment I have made or speech I have given or op ed I have written (or space policy)
In reality I would argue just the opposite. you seem to view space as a human spaceflight game with all the talk of mars settlements, lunar resources etc. “Space” is a profit/loss thing to me. with some national “pride” and future wrapped up …
but the economics of uncrewed flight are seemingly on a daily basis making humans redundant at almost everything in space
“By contrast SpaceshipTwo only real market is taking humans to high
altitudes. They may claim its space if they get high enough, but it’s
really nothing but a high altitude version of what Zero G Corporation
has been doing, basically replicating the 60 year old X-15 flights\”
and that maybe all its market niche demands
” Eventually it will carry humans, but only after numerous flights without any to work out the bugs.”
and the development of that vehicle is a task many orders of magnitude greater then the basic vehicle and many many billionsbeyond what it will take to get to something that just launches “devices”
hence Dear Moon is unlikely this decade (or the next depending on when one measures the 202X decade starting ) 🙂
I have never supported the settlement of Mars in any of my posts. I expect Planetary Protection will block Elon Musk and others from doing it for a number of decades. The Moon is another matter and its value is that its close enough to explore/develop its resources robotically from Earth with only a small workforce being placed on site when the level of operations justify it.
The Starship has the potential to be the game changer for lunar development not because of its size, but because of the new production technology Elon Musk is applying to it that will lower the costs of going to the Moon. Perhaps a better analogy for the Starship would be the Model T that transformed automoblies from being luxuries for the very rich to basic transportation for everyone. The Model T was not just a break through design, but more importantly, a breakthrough in manufacturing. And note, it was the Model T, as Henry Ford had already run through the rest of the alphabet with his earlier attempts. And if it had failed there would have been a Model U. Like Elon Musk he was too stubborn to give up until he succeeded.
The best part is that Elon Musk is using his money to build Starship, money he earned selling launches to the government. And he is not asking the state of Texas to build a spaceport with taxpayer money as Sir Richard Branson did, he is building it himself. So, like Henry Ford, its his gamble, not the taxpayers. It also means that, like Henry Ford, he will be able prove his point to his critics with hardware.
And yes, I do cheer entrepreneurs like him on because they are the drivers of human progress when they win.
In point of fact, Elon really has no choice BUT to go to the moon first. In order to go to Mars, SX needs to be able to launch Starship at least 1-2x / month. Just like he uses NASA/DOD to lower his overall prices, he will need to use lunar missions to lower the cost of missions to mars.
The humorous item here is that William Boeing, the founder of Boeing, has far far more in common with Elon Musk than somebody like Oler. He moved to America from Europe, and was in/out of schools. Like Elon, started on a degree but stopped to go into lumbar business because of opportunity.
From Lumbar he went into Aviation when it was just gettnig started. Oddly, he made heavy use of government to help build some of the most well known aircrafts and used that to lower the costs of flying.
Interesting. No?
Yes, that is how many of the great firms got started, by stubborn dreamers. BTW he was actually born in Detroit, but both his parents came here from Europe and they sent him to Switzerland for prep school. But yes, Mr. Boeing would indeed identify with Elon Musk. Most of the early aviation pioneers would.
lol
Oddly, he made heavy use of government to help build some of the most
well known aircrafts and used that to lower the costs of flying
nothing wrong with that. it is the American way
gads, you can be SOOO pathetic.
You are nothing if not consistent in your full-throated backing of losers – 737 MAX, Bernie Sanders and Richard Branson. At this point, an endorsement by RGO seems to be a pretty good proxy for a kiss of death.
coming from a Trump sycophant thats rich
If I had been king at Boeing, Boeing would have stopped production of the 737 with the 100/200. the decision by Boeing to build the 300 was based solely on SWA and Piedmont (the two launch customers) rejecting the 727/300 (two engine two crew) in favor of the 300.
the NG had a similar story …boeing wanted to develop the 757 lite the designation was 757 400 which would have replaced the 300 with a not so modest scale down of the 757…the decision to build the NG was based on the launch customers SWA, USAir and Lufthansa wanting the NG
the Max had the same story actually Boeing wanted to make a narrow body version of the 777 (hence the leap engine which is the 90’s smaller brother)…but Ryan Air, SWA and the airline I work for…wanted the NG
why? they wanted common type ratings with their previous 737 fleet not common type ratings with the 767 or 777. or the 727/300 which would have been unique in certification (although it would have grown easily into the NG and max versions)
what I have constantly done is defend the Max from ignorance that you and Matula and others have spouted as you babble on from one statement to another defending pilot incompetency on a massive scale
As for Branson. I have no dog with him personally but I do think his VG has a chance for success and do view success as good for the human spaceflight industry.
Right now there are zero commercial space success. Its hard for me anyway to see any “bright lights” in the commercial crew program that I (and Rich Kolker) were one of the first to come out for in the last century
Neither Boeing or SpaceX have excelled themselves in developing what is really a modern Apollo command module…their engineering has been shoddy, their testing weak and managment a joke. Boeings module lost in space or SpaceX shattered to small pieces doesnt give me a warm fuzzy
But neither does the massive amounts of federal dollars which have gone to develop well essentially an updated Apollo command module
If VG manages to get a revenue stream from the flying of non government “people” into space on a consistent basis
that is an achievement that no one has done before. and it will help the future…
as for Bernie. should see where “failure” sticks or doesnt stick soon
I am unabashed in my support for him. I think the nation is really on the wrong track, and has been on it more or less since Ronaldus the Great flew west. its accelerated since Bush43 when every president this century has felt it “good” to go deeper in debt, accomplish less and spend more. all while the very rich get richer, the middle class gets poorer and people like me who are blesssed with various assets work very hard to try and make sure our kids have the same situation that I did as a child. Ie getting into adult hood with asa good a launching point as my parents did
I am pretty comfortable that my wife and I have accomplished that for our kids. but I have fought for the Republic since 17 and seeing it dimishitself in stature year after year since 9/11 2001 has been disturbing for me
I am sure dime store patriots like yourself think things are better off…but when a president can openly violate the law and members of his own party are stuck with “he has learned his lesson” or “ok it was bad but not that bad” or “well it really wasnt bad” we are clearly in trouble
Trump is just the latest of the candidates who say one thing to get elected, then when it comes to government ignore everything they said except the social issue platform they ran on
I have seen people die for lack of health care, or folks merged out of their profession or watched companies screw over people …I could work for any airline in the world, I am the best of the best…but I chose an overseas airline where 1) I made lots of money and 2) had all the social services that are what turn ones life from a guessing game of when catastrophe happens…to one remarkably free from it. at least in terms of the economics of it
you should be so lucky
see how Bernie does in the next few hours. win loose, or draw. I did my part 🙂
Actually its the employees of Boeing that worked on the B737 Max you need to work on straightening it out. Or do you think their emails are based on ignorance as well?
https://www.marketwatch.com…
Boeing employee said 737 Max ‘is designed by clowns’ and ‘supervised by monkeys’
Published: Jan 11, 2020 11:25 a.m. ET
Funny you don’t think the commercial communications satellite industry is a success…
LOL I probably wrote some of those emails. I dont know how far back they go…but well I had choice words about what went into the Max. of course I signed my name to them
I guess life in a nation like Turkey is good for those on the top. But for the rest of the nation it is not as nice as you claim it is.
https://borgenproject.org/c…
Child Poverty in Turkey
“According to a recent report, two out of every three children are affected by child poverty in Turkey. This data is based on the European Union standards of living, which evaluates the material deprivation of the average household.”
“Children are often times denied proper healthcare. According to UNICEF, immunization rates for childhood diseases are in need of improvement, especially in rural areas.”
Again it is about looking at the data, not personal experience as I am sure that as a Captain at Turkish Airline you see only the best parts of life there.
lol you should see poverty in America
So if you were king at Boeing you would have ignored customer preferences.
You expect the rest of us to believe your internet comments more accurate than those of every aviation authority in the world regarding the MAX.
There is a common factor in the failings of the three capsules.
A politician that addresses the deep real problems with real answers can’t get elected as there would be little support and less donations. Bernie just happens to be worse than average in going the wrong direction by promising free crap.
customer preferences are one of those things that you have to massage “carefully and thats not really my end of the “game” …but in the end i….SWA never would have left Boeing with the 300 decision because well they were a massive 737 fleet and had no desire to go to Airbus…it is more tricky with the max…but the FAA put theh stop to the “unlimited type rating” as it allows pilots to only fly two of the four versions…(although I am ok to fly all four and the military versions…but I am unique) 🙂
“You expect the rest of us to believe your internet comments more
accurate than those of every aviation authority in the world regarding
the MAX.”
I dont give a flying leap what you believe. you are one of those internet experts who really has no clue about anything they are talking about
but there is no one out there of any stature saying it was not pilot error…they always blame something like “lack of knowledge etc”
I have more flight time today in heavy jets then you ever will have 🙂
Bernie has real answers. its just nuts on the right that dont want to hear them because they are listening to Trump
I don’t have to be an expert on the MAX or aviation to take the word of every aviation authority in the world over that of an internet troll.
Bernie has answers that amount to, “We’ll give you everything by taking it from the rich.” Ignoring that the beneficiaries will be the same people that caused the problems in the first place. Corruption is not eliminated by giving even more to the culprits.
I don’t have to be an expert on the MAX or aviation to take the word of
every aviation authority in the world over that of an internet troll.
lol so there was nothing the poor pilots on the planes that had parts fall off of them on the ground could do LOL
you are as dumb as they are
Bernies answers amount to changing society back to how it worked before Reaganomics came into affect. you know when we had balanced budgets
Back to the Jimmy Carter years with Bernie. No thanks.
Carter did nto have balanced budgets….they were just so small out of balanced compared with todays that one would be forgiven if one did not notice them
from a tax structure I would suggest more of the 60’s you know when America went to the Moon 🙂
sorry, but have to differ with you on this. I think that there is plenty of need/room for inexpensive sub-orbitals such as VG, along with BO. If both can offer flights for under $1M, divided amongst 6-10 passengers, they will see plenty of passengers.
This is what is needed to spark interest in getting to space.
In addition, I see a big need for training. As the price comes down I would be amazed if multiple nations did not make heavy use of these to train ppl for space.
In addition, to this, we will also need private space stations. Why? Not for ‘commercial work’, but for training to go to the moon. Lots of nations are wanting to be there. It is only a matter of time before America or China puts a base on the moon and these nations want to be there as well.
why we are today, over 50 years since Apollo, where we are today instead of well 20XX a Space odyssey is the simple reality that nothing has been found in space that is worth having humans do them OR is a draw for humanity to spend money to do things there
there are several reasons for this, but one of the major ones in my view is “not” transportation cost to and from space for humans
I think of three major reaqsons
First it is that simply there is nothing to do in space by humans where the development cost to have our machines do it…is not cheaper. and now this develop machine is being extended to “simply replacing machine when it breaks” to now having machines fix machines
MOL dying was a good example…but we have Dynasoar now…just its uncrewed.
in 2001 the book and movie when the AE35 unit broke, Frank had to go out and fix it. today it would be another machine that would do the EVA.
Second where humans might excel over machines is in the laboratory controlling developmental processes…but so far everything from manufactoring drugs to making semi conductors has proved to be illusive. the great hope here is that this might be changing…and it is what Axiom and a lot of other people are counting on…but so far its been a bust
third the experience of “being” in space
and here we are with VG and Musk “Dear Moon” and groups that are trying to offer space as some “gee whiz” adventure in itself. here there are two trends that I think are going to be controlling.
first how much it cost to experience “the experience” and second what you do during that experience. and here their might be some terrestrial equivalent. Almost no one has a perm home on the sea and few ever will…but for those who it is not their job…the sea going experience itself is not enough to make the trip. that is why cruise ships are more or less floating amusement parks…no one I know offers “a week underway in a nuclear sub going under the poles”
and i doubt ever will.
a much smaller number of tourist do “special things” from Climb Everest to well Vomit Comet rides..
thats probably the “space experience” likely in the next 20 or so years (if then) …so it is a group bounded somewhere between 5X million for a few days on orbit to whatever VG cost. its unlikely Musk if his imaginery SSor SSH flies…will come in under the XX million mark for a flight
we will know this year I suspect and for sure by the end of 21 but VG is the first real attempt to find a self sustaining market. we should all wish them luck and safe flights. if they fail particularly because the technology does…its a bad omen for dear moon
VG like the Ansari X-Prize is nothing more that a dead end. Although a failure on its part, killing some celebrity, has the potential to create additional barriers to HSF, its “success”, working through its passenger list without killing anymore people, won’t do anything to move the football down the field. It’s relationship to opening space is about the same as those tourist submarines that Atlantis Adventures operate that allow you to see reef fishes have to developing the resources of the sea. If you don’t see that it’s only because you have been drinking too much of Sir Richard Branson’s kool-aid.
VG like the Ansari X-Prize is nothing more that a dead end. Although a
“failure on its part, killing some celebrity, has the potential to create
additional barriers to HSF, its “success”, working through its
passenger list without killing anymore people, won’t do anything to move
the football down the field”
that is your opinion which we will see if it holds up
if VG succeeds he will have at least gotten human space activities out of the realm of private government and into that of a paying customer…and that while not moving the football down the field, has gotten on the field itself
” It’s relationship to opening space is about the same as those tourist
submarines that Atlantis Adventures operate that allow you to see reef
fishes have to developing the resources of the sea. If you don’t see
that it’s only because you have been drinking too much of Sir Richard
Branson’s kool-aid.
mixing metaphors. those subs have no function in terms of the resources of the sea, their only purpose is to make money by providing an entertainment outlet.
nor for that matter does Branson have anything to do with using the resources of space
Or Musk for that matter
But at least the submarines make money. VG will have to fly 6,000 to 9.000 customers before it pays back the $800 million in development costs and starts making any money. You are looking at that taking 10-15 years even with no time value assigned to the money invested.
money. VG will have to fly 6,000 to 9.000 customers before it pays back
the $800 million in development costs and starts making any money
maybe or maybe not
I dont pretend to know either Musk, Bransom or Bezos or what they are thinking…but its possible they dont care much about being paid back in terms of the money they have put in from their personal fortune
it may just be, particularly in Bezos and Bransom’s case that they are doing this because they have lots of cash and well its something to do
I own three business and the farm (actually I am just keeping the farm for my 9th Grandfather…and at some point the next generation will keep it for him)…two of the business I started out of pocket cash, the farm got “a lot” of the money from the settlement when my late wife was killed bya fedex driver…we would never take out a loan on the farm. never. but the money to move it from cotton to cattle had to come from somewhere.
the third…we borrowed money to buy. it was a chunk of change and well we had to structure the profit/loss motive as to paying back the money we used to buy it
the money from the farm has been paid back in terms of it renewed the endowment settlement of the trust fund from the settlement…but that was all in house…ie it was “free money”
I guess my point of it is that Bransom and Bezos might never have to really “pay themselves” back…but profitize the business simply from ground zero. this is not true of course of the money they borrowed if any (I dont think Bezos has borrowed anything)
but you get what I am saying. I dontknow if any of this is comparable to what RB is thinking or planning. but my only intent on the farm was making sure that the kids, and it go into the future with a solid investment background …and it has it. its more or less trump proof
I dont think RB can do that because his assets are not the equivalent of state land…or maybe with the deals he has cut with NM it is
You forget, VG is now a publicly traded corporation. The money from the IPO likely cashed out several of the earlier investors, including I expect the $200 million Virgin Group originally put in to start this show, while the those investors also likely got stock in the LauncherOne spinoff before the merger/IPO.
The new public stockholders aren’t going to have the same atitude when the promise revenues don’t emerge. The quarterly conference call withh investors are going to be very interesting.
I am holding some stock. 🙂 so its unlikely I would forget
one could find out where the money went of course I dont have the time 🙂 I more or less made the last work for Sanders before the caucus…tomorrow I have to fly so this is it…but…
I suspect that the company will shortly make money 🙂
You holding stock in VG. PT Barnum smiles.
And it may also explain why, like with Boeing, he trash talks Elon Musk who he likely sees as the biggest threat to both firms. By contrast I don’t own stock in either of them or in Tesla.
unless Musk makes commercial airplanes, he is not a threat to Boeing
True, but he is likely to take a chunk out of their space business despite Senator Shelby if he succeeds, and space has been helping Boeing to offset their decline in commercial aircraft revenue.
You are ignoring the possibility of a Musk type going after commercial airplanes. Or a William Boeing, Jack Northrup………..
not so much. either way
yeah, it is not like Elon has spoken of building electric airplanes or coming up with transportation that does 1000 mile much cheaper than aircraft.
he is good at talking
he is also good at doing.
he talks a far better game then he does
I’ll take that over the ones that talk and don’t do.
its strange. if you look at where OSC has gonewith their on orbit resupply…it is now far far more capable then when it started…while all the Musk dreams of red dragon etc…have all faded
True, OSC can occasionally fly with their own vehicles now. That is far more capable considering the troubles when they started. And the Red Dragon dreams have faded into Starship dreams. So you are technically correct, but only technically. Falcon9 successful flight history is over 60 in a row now, and OSC is????
well I am off to bed having made my last call back home to the US for Sanders
but you are 1) judging OSC wrong, they are not in it to be a launch provider and 2) being a launch provider is not where the cost or the profit are. you are comparing apples to steak
Than why is Northrup-Grumman Orbital Sciences ATK building the Omega if they are not looking to be a launch provider?
https://www.space.com/40331…
NOrthrup Grumman wants to be. the OSC part of it is not really a launch company.
I was replying to your previous comment before your airmobile goal posts reacted.
fun money really…I doubt it will be the same…but well I invested in SWA a long time ago…and my Grandparents invested in Boeing before the war… there have been a few other major success stories. thats why I have fun money
not much at stake in it…but who knows
we also have invested in an old Victoria pumping station in the UK near london… 🙂
Dang, I should have chosen inherited money.
and in terms of percentages I have done far better then Trump did 🙂
and holds lots of Boeing stock. 🙂